Kwakgirl, very presumptuous of you to assume it was you I was referring to as living outside the UK and once again wrong. Unless of course your name is Ben Elton or any of the other champagne socialist nom doms who trumpeted it from the rooftops when Bliar was elected in 1997 or one of the unelected bureaucrats from the EU who drew up and impose so much of the Human Rights legislation the UK is now saddled with.
Bit hypocritical to say "I moved to a remote spot to get away from crime as its so bad" and then decry anyone who would like to see the crime problem tackled properly isn't it ? Not everyone can move away from it and have to stay and suffer crime and the consequences of a weak justice system in the UK. Oh well freedom of speech I suppose.
i could live in belfast CBR where crime is pretty much the same as everywhere else in the UK. i moved to Ireland because i love real road racing....i choose to live up on the coast because its quiet and i like it like that and actually its half the price of living in the city!
As the majority of my grandmothers generaton of the family lost their lives in the gas chambers of Belsen and Auschwitz Birkenau, it's a little bit rich to call me a fascist solely for wanting to see a proper deterrent and criminal justice system in this country, and yes my grandmother enjoyed seeing Eichmann executed for his crimes. By your form of logic did Eichmann and his fellow murderers deserve to live ?
invalid characters In: West Sussex
Posts: 647
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See CBR I've had 2 mates murdered, believe it or not my whole life doesn't revolve around Horsham so don't make assumptions!
Also human rights pertain to the treatment of INNOCENT people and they are innocent until proven guilty, once found guilty WE take charge of them, you might think treating them like crap is acceptable, what gives you the right to dictate my limits?
Produce some figures that show the death penalty is the deterrent your so sure it is!
@CBR
Actually you'd be shocked at what goes on in Horsham, it's not all white picket fences and flower arranging, not by any means, and drug deals going on in the streets doesn't only happen in 'that there' London place,
Funny thing is i never saw it when i lived in North London, but come to the stick's and it's as prevalant as you like.
And to answer the heading question,
Yes it should if the crime has been proved beyond doubt, that the perpetrator committed the crime and in these days of DNA profiling etc, etc that is possible i would think, then yes for certain crimes there should be corporal punishment.
It may not be the the voters choice in this namby pamby society we have in the 21st century, but perhaps it's what this country needs to show criminals that they can't just commit a crime and get away with it,
And then get send on a nice holiday at the tax payers expense "because he didn't realise he was doing wrong" yeah right, didn't expect to get caught more like, and copped a plee.
@Blade_rider I grew up not too far from Horsham, and even back in the 60s and 70s, drugs were rife then, and I guess now as well. W.Sussex has many many hiding places for growing and stashing drugs, so its little wonder.
@GreaseyTony Funny you mention the Roy Whiting / Sarah Payne case, as that tragic story criss-crossed my life in nearly every aspect. I was going to use that as an example in my OP, but opted not to as I didn't want to lead the discussion with an actual event. God that story makes me very very sad still. I don't often cry, but I do when I remember the horror of those terrible events.
I've read nearly all the posts in this thread, and whatever folks take on this is, the one thing is clear that everyone agrees on is, JUSTICE. Justice is needed first and foremost for the victims and secondly for society. We as the general public demand justice, where we disagree is to what extent.
My stance on this topic is this. You cannot implement a death penalty en masse as somebody innocent will get caught out at some point, (as has already been pointed out) so it has to be an absolute cast iron case, without any question at all. But more to the point, every case should be judged on its own merit as has been pointed out. Mitigating circumstances come into play too, to prevent the wrongly accused been sent to an irreversible form of punishment.
With many prisons at breaking point, I think its only going to be a matter of time before this issue once again is at the forefront of the public domain.
@Blade
by "nice holiday" are you actually refering to prison? or are you refering to some of the well reported "rehabilition courses" run for some young offenders?
just noticed the comment about corporal (maybe he actually meant capital) punishment too.....im sure some people pay good money for that!
however having attended a primary school where it was a regular occurence on kids as young as 9 i have to say its barbaric, humiliating to the person and dont really remember it was much of a deterent as it was always the same 6 or 7 kids who got it.
Lol, 9 years old? We got it from 5 years old onwards. Everyone feared it and didn't want it. Pretty good discipline record at our school. We've now gone so far the other way now, that kids no longer have any kind of deterrent in their lives. The last 'kid' to disrespect me and my family won't ever do it again, and now says hello nearly every day, and is turning into quite a nice lad, now. But a few years ago was the scurge of many estates in the area. Corporal punishment works on alot of kids, but not all. Its not the application, simply the threat.
invalid characters In: West Sussex
Posts: 647
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Can anyone who supports the use of the death penalty provide any information that suggests it's a deterrent?
If not it must-be retribution. Simple!
Truth is very few of you will-be touched by murder, but a-lot will have the results of petty crime in their lives. Will the reintroduction of the death penalty reduce that?
Demonstrate your reasons please.
Evidence and references please, not your own personal opinion UNLESS that is supported by fact and if it isn't, what are you basing it on?
http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/FaganTestimony.pdf A
pretty good read, bit stuffy though.
There is no definitive answer to your question. If you google "is the
death penalty a deterrent to violent crime" you will get alot of
yes and alot of no answers.
Once again, I think the time, the place and the crime all come into effect
and cannot be judged en masse.
However there does seem to be a correlation between good economic times and recession and the rise and fall of crime with parts of the world that advocate
the death penalty.
The phrase - "You can't please all the people all the time" - springs to mind.
at the end of the day, if you think murder is wrong, then weather it's murder of, or by an individual, or, of or by a group, it's still wrong. if an individual is guilty of killing, and society decides to kill the individual, society is as bad as the murderer.
the death penalty might make ecconomic sense, but I'd hate to be the one having to make a decision based on murder, or incarceration
so should we keep rose west in prison or should she have been hung ? I know which I would go for for when all this came out I was living in gloucester there are meny people in gloucester who have said more than once she should have been hung
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